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  • Isn't this a bit like asking - visual art in water colours versus using oils? They both can be expressive in their own way. It's the evoked emotion that counts.


  • administrators

    I agree expressions do make a big difference, and I've seen some artists use them to great effect. For me it often ends somewhere lower on the list but it really should get more attention :)



  • @'fredfred5150':

    I agree about lack of expressions, about %97 of 3dx women have a permanent "poker face"

    A great facial expression can take a picture to a whole new level, sadly most 3dx artists don't bother doing anything with the face

    True, but those who consistently show up in our "who's your favorite 3dx artist" threads all give that extra attention to the facial expressions.

    The extra bit of detail is what makes the girl stand out, and what makes us take notice.



  • @'matthacker':

    I also wouldn't mind seeing more variations in characters and expressions either.

    I agree about lack of expressions, about %97 of 3dx women have a permanent "poker face"

    A great facial expression can take a picture to a whole new level, sadly most 3dx artists don't bother doing anything with the face



  • Here's a twist.

    What I hate about 3D?
    Variety, or the lack of it. You only see so many variations of V4, though there's plenty of shaping morphs available. Even now, it's still hard to find any images with other figures (even Genesis).

    People also tend to stick to the default style renders. I'd love to see more stylized renderings ie. cel shading renderings, if they're done properly. When it's not, it's more like someone used Photoshop's posterize filter and that's just awful.

    Despite the limits, there's more variations and styles in 2D. I believe because it is easier to achieve a different look. 3D potential is trapped by the limits of its tools (and their learning curve). There's no arguing that it's easier to use a pencil and paper to sketch out ideas than to pose V4 the way you want and still looks good (by default anyway).

    I also wouldn't mind seeing more variations in characters and expressions either. One can only tolerate so many air balloon sized boobs :)

    I'd love to see characters that are more grounded in real life, not just something plucked out of Warcraft and Playboy.



  • This thread is more about "compare and contrast" than it is about "which is better"

    One thing I love about 3d is the "consistency" it offers, once a character is created he/she will look the same and have all the same proportions no what what pose they are put in, that could never happen in handrawn 2d, something would always turn out different


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    @'hzr':

    I dont see it as much of a battle. You can combine both and if youre a real artist you will almost always do alot of postwork and sometimes paint in details etc into your 3d images to make them look that tiny bit better or more convincing.

    it's not so much a battle, but they're clearly two different methodologies and separate learning curves, they compliment each other nicely but generally speaking people tend to go one way or the other

    I'd say a foundation in 2D is going to be very helpful in your 3D endeavours, don't think it's quite as helpful the other way around.

    I think there's no point in saying one is better than the other, it's up to one's individual taste and based on that you can elaborate why you've come to whichever conclusion personally.

    I would point out that if Hollywood animation is anything to go by there's a clear trend here. Actually I can't remember the last 2D animated movie I've seen. Again this doesn't make it right, but it does show overall favor for 3d productions and over time this will reflect more in 3DX as well.



  • I dont see it as much of a battle. You can combine both and if youre a real artist you will almost always do alot of postwork and sometimes paint in details etc into your 3d images to make them look that tiny bit better or more convincing.

    There are so many great images around that have both elements combined in them if you just look around deviantart for example. Its also easier to create real emotions and poses when youre doing it in 2d since the process of painting something gives you alot more freedom to set the poses and expressions, almost like youre working with clay. With those 3d figures it just doesnt feel very natural but rather methodical and abstract. You also need to think outside of the box quite alot on some poses and sometimes its really tedious to find those morphs youre looking for, especially when it comes to expressions.



  • @'miro':

    Well 2D can be extremely elaborate as well, like a painting or check out concept art for movies and games. But as soon as you get complex with 2D you're immediately limited to stills only. With 3DX complex scenes is where it really excels!

    very true about elaborate 2D. i've seen near realistic still images that i'm amazed by. i've never seen 2D animated to be realistic except for movements like the old Disney movies.



  • @'miro':

    But the thing is once have a scene set-up it's like a movie set with actors ready to perform you don't always have to redraw the actors from scratch.

    That is one of the great strengths of 3d, that the computer does a lot of the more "labour intensive" aspects of creation, freeing the artist to concentrate on the bigger picture to a greater degree

    Until someone has had to use a 1-pixel sized brush, they can't appreciate just how labour intensive 2d can be, at least in 3d I assume if you have to use that brush size, you only have to do it once per creation?


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    @'Alpensepp':

    I don't know … I still prefer 2D for the most part.
    My list of 2D artists I'm interested in is rather long, my list of 3D artists... super short lol
    Guess I prefer the manga/comic style with panels, over pure imagesets and imo most 3D scenes still look a lot more "static".
    And I can't say I ever saw an animated 3DX Movie with impressive animation quality, but saw some pretty nice 2D ones...

    yes overall i think there's still stronger output from 2D mainly hentai for me, but I'm pretty sure that will change over the next years, because right now everyone's still focussed on stills, hoping that 3DX animation will get better

    @'fredfred5150':

    Do you all think speed of 2d production is something that makes 2d good?

    Some 2d artists I follow produce new pics on an almost daily basis, compare that to some 3d artists output!

    Yes speed is an issue to a degree but I think more so cost is and complexity! It's easy to get lost in every detail of a scene. But the thing is once have a scene set-up it's like a movie set with actors ready to perform you don't always have to redraw the actors from scratch.

    @'fredfred5150':

    Do you think that because 3d is still very much in its infancy that it hasn't learnt to do the things that we have come to expect an artform/media to be able to do? (well, not on a small scale production basis)

    sure it competes with all forms of porn, you don't give it credit because it's undeveloped, it's got a lot more shaping up to do… but we're getting there :)



  • Do you all think speed of 2d production is something that makes 2d good?

    Some 2d artists I follow produce new pics on an almost daily basis, compare that to some 3d artists output!

    @'Alpensepp':

    most 3D scenes still look a lot more "static".

    I agree 2d artists have had 100's of years to learn to create a sense of motion within a still image (the Baroque style of art is a good example of this)

    Do you think that because 3d is still very much in its infancy that it hasn't learnt to do the things that we have come to expect an artform/media to be able to do? (well, not on a small scale production basis)



  • I don't know … I still prefer 2D for the most part.
    My list of 2D artists I'm interested in is rather long, my list of 3D artists... super short lol
    Guess I prefer the manga/comic style with panels, over pure imagesets and imo most 3D scenes still look a lot more "static".
    And I can't say I ever saw an animated 3DX Movie with impressive animation quality, but saw some pretty nice 2D ones...


  • administrators

    Well 2D can be extremely elaborate as well, like a painting or check out concept art for movies and games. But as soon as you get complex with 2D you're immediately limited to stills only. With 3DX complex scenes is where it really excels!

    Certain things are just better suited for 2D like the Simpsons or South Park maybe. I am surprised at how popular hentai still is over the 3DX version, but I guess that is the next step.

    And I do agree that as soon as you go beyond the standard poser victoria setup things can get infinitely more complex :)



  • yeah, 3D takes 2D to another level.

    some people may not be satisfied with 2D while other poeple would love to see 2D characters in 3D. remember that episode of the Simpsons where Homer was 3D.

    2D is easy to do, all you need is a pen/pencil and paper. 3D is not, it requires much more then a pen/pencil and paper.


  • administrators

    Well I've always liked 2D stuff, hentai in particular.

    To me 3DX takes this genre to another level, the perfect combination of realism and fantasy!

    Also 3dx can be made to look 2D but I haven't seen any 2D that can look 3D at least not animation. That's not a bad thing, just shows the range of 3DX.


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